Facebook: Can Nordic values challenge racism if racism has found a home in such values?

by , under Christian Thibault

Migrant Tales insight:

Christian Thibault is an active anti-racism activist that I’ve had the pleasure to know for some time. In a recent Facebook post below he brings up some good points about how even former and present presidents, like Martti Ahtisaari and Sauli Niinistö, lean towards the promotion of a more exclusive rather than inclusive society. 

No matter how much you try to ignore racism the more you become part of the problem.

I personally support the Nordic model but I understand perfectly well that it has issues with racism. Take a look at Denmark, Norway and Finland as examples. All three of these countries have populist anti-immigration parties poisoning the air with their Islamophobic and xenophobic rhetoric. 

Let’s not forget Anders Breivik and Olli Immonen’s recent declaration of war against cultural diversity. 

Let’s not fool ourselves as well like in Sweden, where some believe that we live in such a perfect society that racism and discrimination no longer exist.


Writes Christian Thibault: 

“The Nordic model of a consensus democracy has a long tradition and is well respectable.

Anyway, lately, there appears to be at least two problems:

1. It only seems to be valid for what are received as ethnic Finns, possibly including Swedish speaking Finns and just maybe the traditional minorities, Tatar-muslims, old Jewish population, finnish Roma and Sami people.

It does not include the about 350.000 people of different ethnicities who have come here and have been born here during the past 35 years, even if one of their parents is a native Finn. Neither does it include the about 350.000 people who are going to come here or who will be born here in the next 10 years.

We are thus creating an unequal non-nordic style of society.

2. For the Perussuomalaiset, if we understand the recent outbursts by their parliamentarians, the principle of a consensus democracy does not exist. Not even for ethnic Finns in case they have different opinions as them.

This might come as a shock to all who have loved the Nordic model of a consensus democracy, but there can be no dialog.
The rise of racism and fascism up into the government ranks is about to bring the end of the Nordic model.

The elected people who are in responsibility for this country better make their choices now.

The Finnish name of the Finns Party is the Perussuomalaiset (PS). The English-language names adopted by the PS, like True Finns or Finns Party, promote in our opinion nativist nationalism and xenophobia. We therefore prefer to use the Finnish name of the party on our postings.

  1. BlandaUpp

    Immigration and integration policy should always be open for debate, nobody would be against this. Things could always be improved. What our media and politicians needs to stop pretending though is that thinly disguised neo-nazi talking points and racism are valid subjects worthy of debate. It’s not just the PS who are responsible for this, other parties are just as guilty, particularly Kokoomus youth wing. Neither leaders of the other 2 coalition parties should act surprised about Immonen’s statements because he and other members of his party have been saying similar and worse things for years.

    Freedom of speech does not mean freedom of hate speech. The internet has democratized all kinds of opinions, even the ones that human beings have come to a consensus about not being up for debate. Humanity has gone through dark times in recent history based on stirred up hatred against certain groups. The Holocaust is a fact, climate change is real, vaccines don’t cause autism and dark skin does not make someone subhuman.

    When the issue of whether “multicultural” people which in Finnish political discussions on the internet is code word for Black or Brown people, evidenced by the constant use of neekeri this, Somali that, are inherently inferior to us natives, it’s not an abstract question, it is racism. Calling for an “argument” or a “conversation” means demanding that people of color defend their own humanity. Whether or not Black or Brown Finns or immigrants who make up less than 0.5% of the country’s population actually engage in these debates, it’s a degrading, draining and demoralizing exercise. It’s energy that could have been spent on more productive pursuits like integration.

    As white native blue eyed blonde Finn, I grew up knowing racism existed here because growing up, some people would call my native Finn brother and sister Mustalainen because they had my native Finn father’s brown eyes and darker hair. Those same people and the children they taught to hate have just moved on to new targets.

  2. MattiR2106

    Freedom from Hate Speech, you mean ….. but therein lies the problem…. To you, as already observed, anything I say which contradicts your narrative could be construed as ‘hate’ speech by you and your supporters…. who gets to convene the list of words and subjects that would not/not be allowed to be discussed in a public forum, never mind, polite company….Who gets to do that??…. I’ll bet dollars to doughnuts that you’ve already got your hand up….. Me, me, me, I want to shut up those swine who do not agree with us….. Tell me it ain’t so!!!…. That’s what this horse shit on this site is mostly about….. if you can take away the conversation, you cover up the truth of both sides of the conversation…. Hence, only your pronouncements make it into the public domain to further confuse the situation around true racism. I submit that as long as there are human beings on this earth, there will be discrimination…. and they come in all colours, races and religions….. not just us introverted Nordic ‘hermits’… Finns. Calling someone ‘mustalainen’ back a few decades was the word for Gypsy…. it was not used in a racial connotation then…. it merely described a darker-skinned, nomadic group of people in Finnish society (they had already been here for hundreds of years)…. Indeed, some people chose to use it pejoratively…. I won’t apologize for it….. I still remember, circa 1948, mustalainen perhe, vankkureineen, tuli meidän tilalle…. keli oli kylmä ja heille annettiin reikäleipää ja minun lapaset menivät pikkuiselle “mustalaiselle” pojalle siksi kun äidilleni kävi sääliksi että hänellä ei ollut lapasia ja kädet olivat sinisiä kylmästä….. That is the kind of racists we were in 1948…. I faintly remember that…..

  3. MattiR2106

    Go screw yourself BlandaUpp!!!!…. who the hell do you think you are calling me an apologist for neo-NAZIs and racists…. I don’t need to answer nor apologize for anybody’s behaviour regardless whose party they are in. You’re a cherry picker…. you choose those parts of every day news that offends you and fly off your rocker…. You should do some peer review on your own pronouncements…. You piss your pants because a political party you despise has gained power in government…. that’s how democracies work… dickhead. The researchers and gallup poll types can research and come up with any conclusion they want…. by blowing up the utterings of a few extrapolating and concentrating on them….. it’s called manipulation … you love it and obviously pleasure yourself endlessly when reading the skewed results……

    • BlandaUpp

      Yes MattiR2106, get mad. Get mad as hell. You’re so filled with rage about just how right I’ve been proven by the terrorist Nazi riots that took place yesterday that you forget to write in your … usual … dismissive … arrogant … verbal diarrhetic … cadence.

      I’ve been proven right many times over. Let me be as sarcastic as to quote myself from the comments I’ve posted in response to you on here over the last few days. Before this week, the last time I replied to anything on this site was 2011. After seeing Immonen’s war talk, I knew I had to respond.

      “Those inciting terrorists are just as responsible as the terrorists themselves. This is why hate preachers both religious and right wing are banned from many countries and why even being found with extremist magazines or found in possession of certain publications is ILLEGAL in many countries. Germany and other countries still have laws against holocaust denial and displaying swastikas exactly for this reason. Even musicians are banned from certain countries because their music incites hatred or violence.

      Of course when it comes to your pet terrorists and your great Mestari, you see no connection between inciting people to intolerance, hatred and violence and the terrorist violence itself. You turn a blind eye to the convicted terrorist Nazis Immonen parades around with from the Finnish Resistance Movement (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Finnish_Resistance_Movement) who one can only assume are his “fellow fighters” he is addressing in his “manifesto”.”

      You MattiR2106, by your daily statements on here, are a neo-Nazis and racist apologist of the highest degree and by extrapolation, you yourself are a neo-Nazis and racist.

  4. Malik

    u thinking u knowing English well but you making mistakes all the time……..

    you say Matti writing in cadence but cadence meaning always being according to webster:
    Cadence=a regular beat or rhythm; the way a person’s voice changes by gently rising and falling while he or she is speaking; an ending part of a piece of music.

    now this even i knowing has nothing doing with writing style.

    why you using big english words when you not knowing meaning?

  5. Malik

    also it not being neo-nazis but actually being neo-nazi. it is like you saying sheeps instead of sheep. this much english even i am knowing.

    anybody saying anything on this website that not agreeing with you or your other brothers here is getting called bad names or getting removed. this not being way to discuss things in civilized way but this being very much like dictator fascist way of behaving…….so that meaning if people disagreeing with you then disagreeing people can get out………you and your other brothers are really fascists in disguise shutting up other opinions.

  6. BlandaUpp

    Dear Malik, I’ve spoken English since the age of 10 which means that I’ve spoken it for well over 30 years now. As part of my University education, I continued studying English as a minor and I’ve also written my PhD dissertation completely in English at a University in England. I’ve also spoken it to my English-born wife every day for the last 17 years. I am also usually assumed to be English myself due to the absence of any Finnish accent in my spoken English. Someone who can barely put together a sentence in English should not question my knowledge of the language when they are unable to challenge my ideas. Just for the record, a cadence is “a rhythmic sequence or flow of sounds in language”, also “the beat, time, or measure of rhythmical motion or activity” which perfectly describes the mockery which is MattiR2106’s style of writing. If you are truly interested in learning about cadence in language use, read this http://literarydevices.net/cadence/

    • Malik

      you study in England that mean you paying money………education not free there………your English sounding fake when you write many sentences it not nice. when somebody like me not putting a sentence nice saying it not nice meaning you should use Finnish. Puhu Suomea?

    • Malik

      then do you drink tea and eat crumpets? or you prefer biscuits with tea? ja sinä juot kahvia ja syöt pullaa………….

      i ask only because you being highly educated british-finnish to bless us on this website with very perfect english a very special man indeed. do you also after drinking tea walk in your garden? or you prefer some pints instead aye mate??

  7. MattiR2106

    You wasted a lot of money for your education BlandaUpp… because it’s obvious you learned very little… When your own argument is bankrupt…. go after the messenger… that’s the ticket old chum. I don’t give a damn about what you think of my writing style… Less than 40 neo-Nazi types made up that ‘crowd’ in Jyvaskyla the other and 7 of them were arrested…. and you’re going on like a rabid dog foaming at the mouth about them…. Whatever it is that offends you so about what Immonen or any other PS parliamentarian says is a trigger for you to blow your jets…. However I’ll grant you one positive…. you’re a level-headed nutcase: the shit runs out of both ears…. in an equal and steady stream.

    • BlandaUpp

      Education is free MattiR2106 . If you actually got one you would know that.

  8. MattiR2106

    Of course I didn’t get an education…. lived under a rock for decades on end…. That’s where I learned my English…. Universities these days are little more than indoctrination factories…where willing and ‘useful’ idiots have their heads filled with shit…. by Über Left and Liberal profs whose only job is to inculcate you into their own likeness…. politically….