An immigrant call to change and Finnish society

by , under All categories, Enrique

Some wrongfully accuse those of speaking up for cultural diversity in Finland of “whining” and being “ungrateful.” Apart from exercising one’s democratic right of free speech, bigger steps have to be taken by minorities in this country to drive home their message of greater equality and fair treatment.

If we wait for change it will never happen in our lifetimes.

In my opinion, the situation of immigrants in Finland is tragic and shameful. On the one hand, you have people who want to eagerly take part in this society but cannot due to a number of imagined and real factors such as language, while Finnish authorities simultaneously spend a lot of funds and good will on integrating these persons to our society.

The integration program, although well-intentioned, lacks one very important component in order for it to be successful: Immigrants’ input. The program is the majority’s view on how newcomers should integrate into our society.

On many occasions I have mentioned that we do not need any magic trick to integrate immigrants and refugees. Those very values that makeup our society would be enough. However, the problem is that these legal benchmarks enshrined in the Constitution and Non-Discrimination Act do not apply to minorities who don’t speak Finnish or Swedish as natives.

Real integration does not only mean job opportunities but, most importantly, a willingness by society to accept these people. Today unemployment among immigrants is officially 2-3 higher than the national level and by looking at the silence and lack of leadership of Finnish politicians, the closed view of institutions such as the police and the constant attacks by hardline “Finland for Finns” proponents, it is clear what a significant part of the population thinks.

We are still at such a diaper stage in the immigrant debate that some of our politicians and policy-makers do not even grasp why immigration is important for this country but prefer instead to stick their heads in the sand and hide behind nationalism.

Change will not come from the majority because there is a definite lack of leadership in this area. If this is so, we must spearhead change and make our voices heard and take part more vociferously than ever in the ongoing one-sided debate on immigrants in Finland. We must lobby politicians and use all the opportunities and channels offered by democratic society to make our voices heard.

That time has come now.

  1. Martin-Éric

    I’m already there working on these issues. It’s not really that the Integration Act is based on what the majority wants (if it were, it would be called the Massive Deportation Act). Rather, it’s based on what a handful of bureaucrats from a few ministries have decided top-down, without consulting the population and without consulting immigrants already here for feedback on what could be done better. In other words, it’s typical top-down Finnish bureaucracy, only since this particular law concerns people who already have fewer rights than citizens, the consequences of this dysfunctional Three Path draft have much more serious consequences than, say, an ill-conceived change in the taxation Law.

    • Enrique

      –I’m already there working on these issues. It’s not really that the Integration Act is based on what the majority wants (if it were, it would be called the Massive Deportation Act).

      Hi Martin-Éric, those are some very good comments your made. Even so, will disagree with you: those laws are a reflection of our values. If it’s not as you claim, what values are we speaking of?

      One part of what you said made me think a lot and reinforced something that has worried me in the past. Finland has had very, very few foreigners in the past and every year there are more. Much of the perception of Finns of other people hinges on education and what they have been taught by society (mistrust outsiders). Then, as you point out, we have two key laws (Constittuion and Non-Discrimination Act) that tell the population to be open and understanding. It is like making a jump from being a very closed society to a very open one without ever going through the intermediary stage.

      Thank you Martin Éric.

  2. Martin-Éric

    Enrique, my main point was that laws in Finland are seldom a reflection of what the population wants. Instead, they are decided top-down by a small group of bureaucrats who are completely disconnect from reality, without consulting any of the target groups concerned by any legal draft, be they Finns or immigrants. This observation doesn’t just concern immigration-related laws, it concerns the legislative process as a whole. Think of Lex Karpela and Lex Nokia for other good examples of this top-down “we know better than you, since we’re asiantuntija, so we’re gonna ignore you” approach.

  3. Tiwaz

    REAL problem is that immigrants are stupid or lazy. At least large number of them are.

    Enrique, you whine that immigrants are not treated equally. What you see is them BEING treated equally.

    FINLAND HAS ONLY TWO OFFICIAL LANGUAGES AND ONLY ONE OF THEM IS SPOKEN BY HUGE MAJORITY.

    WHAT AN IMBECILE PRESUMES TO BE ABLE TO ACT IN SOCIETY WITHOUT ABILITY TO COMMUNICATE WITH THE SOCIETY?

    There, that underlines the actual issue immigrants face. They cannot accept that THEY must change.

    The very title of this thread shows how wrong you approach this issue Enrique. It implies that immigrants somehow have some right to demand NATIVES to change.

    Immigrants are treated equally. They are treated just like native Finn would be treated if Finn were to be unable to speak or act properly.

    Problem is not with Finns, demanding that we switch our culture to Somalian when Somali walks to us, then next moment to Guatemalan because Guatemalan walks to us and finally we have to switch our culture to hubbabubban because hubbabubbist wandered into the room.

    Not only is that impossible, we cannot identify your culture from your looks nor can we know different practices of every single fucking culture on this planet, it is idiotic and racist.

    Immigrants should accept that THEY have to learn Finnish language and culture and learn to USE them. This way, every single immigrant would only have to learn ONE foreign language and ONE foreign culture on top of those they already know.

    And they could act in society, and they could interact between each other without problems as Finnish culture would be common framework for both.

    -“Then, as you point out, we have two key laws (Constittuion and Non-Discrimination Act) that tell the population to be open and understanding.”

    WRONG AGAIN!

    Those laws do NOT demand us to toss our OWN culture into corner and appease you foreigners. They just grant you right to act like an ass. But it does NOT demand that we Finns must ignore it.

    We Finns have all the same rights to demand OUR cultural norms to be respected and that WE are not treated in racist way. Which is becoming bigger problem than Finns being racist.

    Have you read your own arguments Enrique? They have disturbing trend where you pile up all the blame on Finns. Finns are evil, Finns are xenophobic, Finns refuse to respect other cultures, Finns must change.

    When have you stopped and wondered if all this is result of immigrants being xenophobic racists who refuse to accept that Finland has it’s own unique culture, and things here are done according to this unique culture?

    Why in your view immigrants have no responsibilities but only rights and Finns have no rights but only responsibilities to satisfy demands of foreigners?

    Because you are foreigner! You say you are Finn, but no Finn would ever identify you as one because you show zero respect for US, OUR way of life and OUR culture.

    Real problem of integration and assimilation is between ears of immigrants. Finns could use ten billion in various programs but if immigrant refuses to change that attitude which they have between their ears, it is all pointless.

    You do not learn language if you do not want to. Nor do you learn how to act properly.

  4. Tony Garcia

    “Instead, they are decided top-down by a small group of bureaucrats who are completely disconnect from reality,”

    Yep, there is a name for that , It’s called Socialism.

    The bigger the state the smaller the individual…

  5. Tony Garcia

    Two things we’ll always see, the failure of integration programs and the multicultural left complaining about them. Why?

    First. Simple, those programs are made for people who doesn’t want to integrate. Do you know who much the Finnish government spent on my integration? 0€. Willy if you are reading this care to tell us how much they spent on yours? My bet is a big 0. And I know many other cases – people came, saw how things work and lived by those parameters, integration done. If you want to integrate you just do it, if you don’t…

    Second. Why the left always complain about those programs? The answer is written right here… “The program is the majority’s view on how newcomers should integrate into our society”. This phrase explains it all.

    To understand we need to see what the left wants. Have you ever asked yourself why, if the problem is lack of skilled workers, we don’t see calls for a program of incentives to bring in Americans, Western Europeans and South East Asians? Why to solve lack of skill we have to bring in so unskilled people? Because they bring something else with them, something far more valuable than skill, the so called “diversity”, one of the Gods of multiculturalism. And understand this is fundamental.

    During 10 years NuLabour has secretly done it to Brittan, but last year they came out of the closet. Ageing population and lack of skilled professionals were used to change the makeup of Brittan. And that’s is what we are talking about here, changing the makeup of Finland.

    Why my and Will’s opinions are always criticized here? After all we both succeeded very well in Finland. Because our move here didn’t bring change to Finland but instead we changed ourselves. We adapted and “adaptation” is a sin in the multicultural fate. We are what they call a “wasted asset”.

    So, that being said, it’s easy to understand, they don’t want the newcomers to integrate into the Finnish society but to change it.

    • Enrique

      –Why my and Will’s opinions are always criticized here? After all we both succeeded very well in Finland. Because our move here didn’t bring change to Finland but instead we changed ourselves. We adapted and “adaptation” is a sin in the multicultural fate. We are what they call a “wasted asset”.

      Have yours or Willi’s opinions been criticized to the breaking point here? Really, Tony. Do you really think that it is a “sin” to adapt in a multicultural society? Remember when you criticized the headline I had, well I think you are now overstretching it a bit too far.

      –Second. Why the left always complain about those programs? The answer is written right here… “The program is the majority’s view on how newcomers should integrate into our society”. This phrase explains it all.

      Complain about the programs? Come on, Tony, read the laws and the Constitution. In any pluralistic and democratic society there are things such as freedom of religion, speech and political thought. I don’t understand what kind of a society you want to achieve.

      Moreover I agree with Martin-Éric: most immigrants who move to Finland survive the best they can and they do pretty well taking into account the situation with respect to work.

  6. Martin-Éric

    Tony, my integration cost this country nothing as well. The point is that it’s more convenient for a few trolls to think that each and every foreigner is an unskilled third-country refugee than to admit that the majority of immigrants come here because of marriage or work and we all integrated just fine.

  7. hannu

    “In any pluralistic and democratic society there are things such as freedom of religion, speech and political thought.”

    According to you only for those who “think right”

  8. Tiwaz

    -“The point is that it’s more convenient for a few trolls to think that each and every foreigner is an unskilled third-country refugee than to admit that the majority of immigrants come here because of marriage or work and we all integrated just fine.”

    The point is, huge number of immigrants do NOT. And multiculturalist mob wants to increase this number of unintegrated useless wastes of space in name of diversity.

    Diversity is not some kind of holy grail. Rarely if ever has diversity in cultures brought anything but misery to society. And in those cases where it has managed to have positive impact, diversity has been secondary to supreme position of ONE culture.

    In Roman empire, there was diversity. But Roman way of life was ALWAYS on top.

    When you try to put multiple cultures on same place, they start fighting.

    Issue which you refuse to accept is that there is very large, and increasing, portion of immigrants who refuse to adjust to realities of moving to another country. Many “integrated” immigrants actually fail to integrate. They keep whining why things are not “like at home”. Coffee is bad, food is bland, houses are built wrong, people are rude, nobody talks to you and so forth. None of them respects that Finns have different tastes.

    We like our coffee acidic, by and large our preference with foods is towards one with less spiced ones. These are things which are part of our culture, even if they slowly change. We do not chitchat with people, we do not want to sit next to someone in bus (violation of privacy), we do not open doors to people who are clearly capable of doing it yourself.

    But immigrants refuse to accept this. You guys have attitude of some sort of fucking colonial lords who stroll to meet forest barbarians with your fine ways and demand immediate appeasement!

    Enrique often expresses this PRECISE attitude as we see. He always demands that FINNS must change their culture and society to appease immigrants. Never he smacks lazy arsed immigrants around their ears and tells them that they are being idiots if they expect Finland to become like hattivattiland where they originated from.

    If you cannot adjust to Finland, leave. Our laws grant you absolute freedom to fuck off and leave us in peace!
    There is ZERO laws requiring us Finns to appease you foreigners by bending over and doing things your way because you are too stupid or lazy to learn our way.

    Got a job? Resign and find new one in “better” country!
    Got married? Tell spouse to either move with your or divorce and move to “better” country!

    Just stop telling ME, who am quite happy here unlike I have been elsewhere, that I must change my lifestyle and culture in my native land because you can’t handle it.

    Problems of integration start around left ear of immigrant and around right ear of immigrant. Space between those points is where real problems are.

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